Day in the Life
Journal Entry
July 13, 1859 ~ Wednesday
July 13th I went over Jordon & staked out my grass ground
& went to the office at 1 oclock I found President Young
& D H Wells in the office President Young invited me
to meet at his House at 2 oclok as He was going to have
an interview with Horace Greely I met agreeable to invitation
I Found Mr Greely A singular looking man He
was midling well dressed white but bald Headed his
head vary dirty looked as though He had not washed
his Head since He came off the plains He had quite
a feminine soft green appearance He asked many Questions
Questions Asked By Horace Greely & Answered By Brigham Young
At 2 oclock P.M. The following Persons met at President Youngs
upper Room Lion House in the Mansion B Young H. C. Kimball
D H. Wells J. M. Bernhisel W Woodruff S M Blair H Stout
A Carrington, J. Ferguson Elias Smith, & Horace Greely Editor
of the Tribune when the following conversation took place
after the company was introduced to Mr Greely by the
Hon J. M. Bernhisel. Also Joseph & Brigham Young Jr was
introduced But they soon left. Mr Greely asked President
Young what is the difference between your religion & Church
from the Christian world. B. Y. The difference betwen us is
that we believe that No Church is the Church of God who
has not the Holy Priesthood. We have the Priesthood & the
sects of the day have not got it. The Lord has delivered the
Priesthood unto us & without the priesthood no man has auth-
ority to administer in the ordinances of the gospel. G do you
believe in faith & what is it" B Y We do. Paul said it was
the substance of things hopede for & the evidence of things hoped for ^not seen^. [Hebrews 11:1]
G. What do you Believe about slavery. B. Y. We believe what
the Bible sayes about it, there was a curse put upon Cain
& his seed & that curse will remain untill it wais taken
off they were to be servants. G is this a slave territory
or are there slaves here. Y There is slaves here or have been
from time to time. G Then this would become a slave state
would it not if it was admitted. Y. No the climate & situ-
ation would not admit of it. slavery is a thing I do not
want any thing to do with it. I consider it more of a
course [curse] to a man to have slaves than a Blessing. G So I
think. do you tithe the people if so what for. Y. Yes
one tenth to Build Temples, & to Feed the poor, and I
want you to understand one thing & I want you to write
it just as I tell you & that is I do not have so much
as one cabbage or ear of corn of the tithing ownly what
I pay for. G Do you have a salary. Y. No sir not one
cent. G Then how do you get your living. Y I would
think myself a poor financeer if I could not work
for Nothing & keep myself. There is No man from the
Highest to the lowest in the Church that Has a salary. The
Presidency Twelve, Seventies & all the Elders who labour for
the interest of the Church do it without a salary the Elders
travel the world over as it were & go without purse or
scrip or money & all preach without a salary. While building
a Temple in Kirtland we had a committee of three who
spent there whole time they were allowed $1 per day each
man. We had a committee of three in building the
Nauvoo Temple they had $2 per day each. WeI do not no
know of any other who have a salary. Joseph Smith
on[c]e gave H. C. Kimball credit of $2 on Book for some
labour. Brother Kimball had it taken off said he would
not have a credit for it. We have appointed a committe
of one Mr D H Wells here to superintend the building
of a Temple here. He has No salary. I prefer a committe
of one instead of any more to transact any kind of busines
if I want to do it with dispatch then he does not have
others to council but can act upon his own judgment
we hire men ^& clerks^ to work in the Church who spend all ther
time as day labourers we pay them wages. G. Do not
the Bishops have salary's? Y. No Sir. [G.] Are all the Mormons
under obligation to gather together and upon what principl
are they required to gather. Y Yes we consider
ourselves under obligation to gather together By the comma-
ndments of God the Bible teaches the subject of the Gathering
in the last days. G we have understood that the Bible
teaches the Jews to gather to old Jerrusalem Y. Yes &
it also teaches the Saints to gather to Zion. G Do you
think there can be any collission between the Mormons
& the United States. Y Not if they let us alone & do not
persecute us more than we are able to bear, but they can
croud us to a point which would make a collission
[G.] What was the cause of so much oposition to Joseph Smith
they accused him of stealing Horses & cattle & doing much
evil. Now the Methodist used to be much opposed &
were vary unpopular But I do not recollect of hearing
them accused of such crimes as the Mormons are
I am vary unpopular in my religion I am a whole
souled Universalist yet we are not accused of such
crimes & I do not recollect that the Saints were in the
days of Christ. B. Y I think sir if you will look
carefully at the History of Christ & the Apostles you
will find that all manner of Evil was spoken against
them falsly. As to Joseph Smith he was a good man
& he was persecuted even unto death becasuse he did
do good. He passed through over 30 law suits got up
by his enemies & it was shown in evry instance that
He was innocent & it was got up through persecution
G What are the Danites and what information can you
give me concerning them. Y I cannot give you any
information conserning them you will have to enquiring
of our Enemies & they can tell you all about it, we know
nothing about any Danites we have no such society or
company among us. G You are accused of many crimes
Y And so were the saints in the days of Christ & the Apostles
evry exertion has been made from the begining to Bring some
accusation against us while trying Joseph in Missouri before
Judge A King. He asked Joseph if he believed in the setling
of the kingdom in the last days that the prophet Daniel spoke
of Joseph said he believed what the Bible said about it the
Judge said clerk put that down that is treason Col Dona-
phan who was Josephs Lawyier said you had better
make the bible treason & don with it. In the days of Christ
the Jews said if we let him alone he will come & take away
our state & Nation that is what our enemies are afraid
of now that we shall esstablish the kingdom of God
G do you believe in infant sprinkling. Y. No we baptize
Believers By ememersion. G do you believe in any New
new doctrin Y no none ownly what the Bible & Book of mormon
teaches, have you not read the Book of Mormon G But vary
little of it. How extensive are miracle in the Church & are
they confined to the leaders of the Church. Y They are as
extensive as it is the will of God to give they arne not confined
to the Head But all Elders lay hands upon the sick when
called upon and the sick are often healed. G yes but some
die I suppose. Y Yes the saints & sinners have died in
every age. Death has passed upon all mankind & they cannot
escape it. G Your doctrin of Polygamy is not that
against the Bible. Paul said A Bishop should have one wife [1 Timothy 3:2]
Y. that is correct Doctrin you should not take a single
man for a Bishop he should at least have one wife But
Paul did not say that he should not have but one there
is nothing in Pauls words against his having a dozen
[G.] How many wives has any one man had in the Church
B. Y. I suppose I have as many as any one man I have
some 15 I have some aged women sealed to me upon the
principle of sealing which I no more think of making
a wife of than I would my Grand Mother. G Has it
been long that Poligamy has been practiced in the Church
Y it has ben practiced for some 16 years have you not read
the revelation given upon that subject? G I have not I think
it has not been published till late. Did Joseph Smith have
more than one wife. Y The revelation was publishis
in Aug 1852. Joseph Smith had more than one wife
G How do the women receive the Doctrin Y Quite as
well as the men. I do not think there is a woman in the
Church that opposed it inmore than I did in my feelings
How many wives have you Mr Greely. G ownly one
H. C. K. How many Misses do you keep. G Not any.
B Y I do not think their is a member of the Church in this
room that has had any connexion with a woman except his
wife if Mr Greely can say as much, then I think you are
virtuous. (He did not answer it.) G. I would like to visit
your schools while here do you have free schools do the
Church pay for the schooling of all the children Y No all
pay their own schooling at present. G I hear that the
Church is rich. Y The Church have some buildings here
G While Journeying here it was reported that the animals
of the emigrating trains belonged to the Church. Y The[y] are
not Church animals they belong to members of the Church
probably. G. Were not the leaders of the Church poor you
say you have no salary. you seem to be wealthy I do not see
how you get your property B. Y. I gathered some property
in kirtland. I earned it with my hands except half
of a pig which weighed 90 lbs which Joseph Gave me we
had to leave kirtland through persecution I came to
Nauvoo with nothing I there got a property through
my labor & the Blessings of God. We were driven from
our property there & I had to Borrow to get here & now
my Property I suppose is worth some three hundred thou-
sand dollars and you may ask any man in heaven
Earth or Hell, if I have wronged him out of a dollar
and if you can find such a man I will make it right
I have wronged No man I have paid for what I have
had as I have said I do not have as much as an ear of
corn out of the tithing office ownly what I pay for I Borrowed
money to help the poor when I came here and I want
you to write my statement as I give it for it is true as
the Son. I financeer my affairs according to the wisdom
God has given me & I trust to him & he alone gives
me my increase. there isare fears here that there will
not any potatoes grow I shall look for potatoes when it
is time to dig them I do so with all my business the
Lord kan make me rich or poor Just as he pleases
I care not a groat for all the gold & silver in the world
and Jesus Christ did not. G. The leaders of the Church
must have some advantage the city lots here sold for some
price did it not go to the leaders of the Church. Y No all
the setlers paid for their city lots was $1.50 $1 to the
surveyor Mr Sherwood & 50 cts to Thomas Bullock the
recorder. G How do you get farmes here. Y The
land belongs to the United States and all the claim setlers
have is possession and improvements when men take
up unsurveyed lands they pay the surveyors fees & when
they buy improvements they pay for them according
to there value. & what they produce all men like to
speculate more or less & men are apt to get what they
can. G I calculate that I am about the ownly man
who speculates who has not bought some land in the wes-
tern country, or a city lot, many who have speculated
in land have become poor.
You have had two or three
split off's. How do you consider them? Y. The same as
all apostates. G Do the Bishops make Bishops or how is it
done. Y The people meet in conference and if they want
a man to preside over them as a Bishop they vote for him
and he is ordained a Bishop to preside over them.
G Can the people reduce a Bishop to the layity Y. The
people can remove a Bishop from presiding over them by
a vote & chuse the one they wish. G who is the President
of the Church. Y you know that I am the President
of the Church. I have my two councellors Mr Kimball
& Wells here are my councellors. Then we have Twelve
Apostles & Seventies & various Quorums in our organizat-
ion. G My neighbors religion does not trouble me any
how & I see no particular harm in your religion and
I am glad to learn so much from you about the rule
management, & orgainization of your Church I now
[k]now much more about your Church than I ever have
before. How many clergy men of other sects have Joined
your Church. Y not a great many & they are not often
worth much when they do Join. For the clergy men
Doctors & Lawyiers make about as poor Saints as any class
of men we have for they do not like to work much & the
mormons work for a living and I believe I am about
the ownly man who does not work. G I think there
is not many Editors come among you by the looks of the
papers published here. Y No and if they should we should
be careful not to employ them to publish for us
G I think it would be a good plan to sow the Canida thistle
all over the sage plains & deserts it would renevate the
soil & make food for cattle. Y if that is your opinion
pray dont tell the people of it for you could not introduce
a worse plague if the people was ^to^ introduce Canida Thistles
it would come Nearer to driving out the mormons from the
country than any elsthing els. they would ruin any country
G O I think they would be a great Benefit & if they got
into your grass & farming land you can eisily kill them by
mowing & salting them. Y I think not. G I think the
Army was sent here esspecially for your Benefit & the
Benefit of Wardle & Russel, you are getting rich through
the army. Y The people are making money from that source
they introduce money, cattle, waggons Horses & Mules.
The people buy the waggons for the Irons for $15 or $20
of the largest class, containing some 6 or 800 lbs which
is quite a help to the country whare Irons is scearce. G.
The whole country is lined with Iron. there is many
miles of chains & if I lived in the country I would pick
it up & cash it. Y The Government would claim it
G I would give them so many days Notice then to take
it out of the way & if they did not do it I would take
it myself. There is more good timber in one of those
large freight waggons than grows in this whole Territory
I dont believe in your having a Famine or that there
is going to be any Famine. Y what do you refer to. G I
see it published in the Deseret News. Y. yes you refer to
Orson Hydes Famine sermon. G We had 2 frost in the
states & it was reported that evry thing was killed on
the 11th June in the North But I do not think that the
frosted district was vary extensive. [Y.] We are improving
evry year in agricultural pursuits & when we get all the Dr
& Lawyiers to work we shall raise all you want. I dont
think we shall have any Famine. I have travelled through
many parts of Europe they are capable of raising much
food, I think Lombardy with its irrigation is the richest
part of Europe. [G.] Mr Young I shall have to state in my
report that I consider your system of poligamy is reducing
the female Here to the oriental state I see no chance for the
female here for her to develop herself. I see no Female signs
out in this city. I see no chance for a woman ownly to be
a first or fifteenth wife. Y A woman here has all the
chance or liberty here to develop her talent or capabilities
of doing good & filling her sphere that she has in any country
But I do not want any woman to council & dictate me
in the direction of my affairs if I did I should think I
ought to have been made a woman. G I dont care whether
a person is man or woman I think they should have the priv-
lege of Developing their Talent, it is well enough for a
woman to bear children But I think they ought to rule
when they are capable of it. Queen Elizabeth was the greatest
Ruler England Had And Catherine was one of the greatest
sovreigns of Russia But Poligamy I think has a tendency to bury
up the talent of women. H. C. K. is it worse to be a mans second
wife than to be a horewhore? G I dont know that it is.
Here Mr Greely closed his interigations. Took his
hat Bowed to the company & retired
After Mr Greely left conversation turned upon the oppositi-
on of our enemies. President Young said the Lord has said he
would fight our Battles & give us the victory & he has done it
thus Far. Should the Lord say now draw the sword & fight
many would cut their way through an Enemy & turn
around & fight over the spoil. this would gratify two many
evil hearts and that would not do President Kimball said
God holds Gov Cummings to do his will for us if He was to
leg go of him he would be our bitter Enemy
People
Browse people Wilford Woodruff mentioned on this day in his journal. Click on the person's name to view a short bio and other pages they are mentioned on or click on "View in Family Search" to view their FamilySearch profile.
Carrington, Albert
8 Jan 1813 - 19 Sep 1889
232 mentions
Apostle
Doniphan, Alexander William
9 Jul 1808 - 8 Aug 1887
5 mentions
Cumming, Alfred
1802-1873
74 mentions
King, Austin Augustus
21 Sep 1802 - 22 Apr 1870
1 mention
Young, Brigham
1 Jun 1801 - 29 Aug 1877
3459 mentions
Apostle, Family
Young, Brigham (Jr.)
18 Dec 1836 - 11 Apr 1903
589 mentions
Apostle
31 mentions
Scriptural Figure
Catherine II of Russia
2 May 1729 - 17 Nov 1796
1 mention
Historical Figure
88 mentions
Scriptural Figure
Wells, Daniel Hanmer
27 Oct 1814 - 24 Mar 1891
800 mentions
Apostle
Smith, Elias, b. 1804
6 Sep 1804 - 24 Jun 1888
190 mentions
Elizabeth I of England
7 Sep 1533 - 24 Mar 1603
19 mentions
Historical Figure
Kimball, Heber Chase
14 Jun 1801 - 22 Jun 1868
1460 mentions
Apostle
Sherwood, Henry Garlick
20 Apr 1785 - 24 Nov 1867
26 mentions
Greeley, Horace
1811-1872
13 mentions
Stout, Hosea
18 Sep 1810 - 2 Mar 1889
54 mentions
Ferguson, James
23 Feb 1828 - 30 Aug 1863
71 mentions
Bernhisel, John Milton
23 Jun 1799 - 28 Sep 1881
321 mentions
Young, Joseph Angell
14 Oct 1834 - 5 Oct 1875
76 mentions
Apostle
Smith, Joseph (Jr.)
23 Dec 1805 - 27 Jun 1844
2386 mentions
Hyde, Orson
8 Jan 1805 - 28 Nov 1878
697 mentions
Apostle
159 mentions
Scriptural Figure
Blair, Seth Millington
13 Mar 1819 - 17 Mar 1875
70 mentions
Bullock, Thomas
23 Dec 1816 - 10 Feb 1885
128 mentions
Places
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Quotes
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Mr Greely asked President Young what is the difference between your religion & Church from the Christian world. B. Y. The difference between us is that we believe that No Church is the Church of God who has not the Holy Priesthood. We have the Priesthood & the sects of the day have not got it. The Lord has delivered the Priesthood unto us & without the priesthood no man has auth- ority to administer in the ordinances of the gospel.
~ Brigham Young
G Then this would become a slave state would it not if it was admitted. Y. No the climate & situ- ation would not admit of it. slavery is a thing I do not want any thing to do with it. I consider it more of a course [curse] to a man to have slaves than a Blessing.
~ Brigham Young
if you will look carefully at the History of Christ & the Apostles you will find that all manner of Evil was spoken against them falsly. As to Joseph Smith he was a good man & he was persecuted even unto death becasuse he did do good. He passed through over 30 law suits got up by his enemies & it was shown in evry instace that He was innocent & it was got up through persecution
~ Brigham Young
have you not read the Book of Mormon G But vary little of it. How extensive are miracle in the Church & are they confined to the leaders of the Church. Y They are as extensive as it is the will of God to give they arne not confined to the Head But all Elders lay hands upon the sick when called upon and the sick are often healed.
~ Brigham Young
I have wronged No man I have paid for what I have had as I have said I do not have as much as an ear of corn out of the tithing office ownly what I pay for I Borrowed money to help the poor when I came here and I want you to write my statement as I give it for it is true as the Son. I financeer my affairs according to the wisdom God has given me & I trust to him & he alone gives me my increase. there isare fears here that there will not any potatoes grow I shall look for potatoes when it is time to dig them I do so with all my business the Lord kan make me rich or poor Just as he pleases I care not a groat for all the gold & silver in the world and Jesus Christ did not.
~ Brigham Young
Events
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